Hyphenation of Greek compounds

[wehro]

The documentation of the liturgical patterns should make more clear, how Greek compounds shall be hyphenated.
From the example a-pos-to-los one might guess that Greek prefixes (in this case apo-) are ignored. In accordance with this, the patterns yield e-pis-co-pus (Greek prefix epi-) and the test file wordlist-liturgical.txt contains the following examples ignoring a Greek prefix:

• e-pis-tra-te-gi-a
• e-pis-tra-te-gus
• a-pos-to-lo-rum
• a-pos-phra-gis-ma
• pseu-de-ne-drus
• pseu-di-so-do-mos

One the other hand, the same test file contains the following entries, that only make sense from an etymological point of view:

• e-pi-stro-phe
• a-po-stro-pha
• a-po-stro-phe
• a-po-stro-phos
• a-po-sple-nos
• a-na-stro-phe
• pseud-an-chu-sa
• pseud-a-pos-to-lus
• pseu-do-sma-rag-dus
• pseu-do-sphex

In my opinion, this is not consistent.

[fradec]

Thank you for your vigilance.

You are right, it needs to be reviewed in a global way. However, the 2nd list is correct for us, since a word like stropha is passed as is in Latin, which is not the case for stolos (which come from στέλλω, not from στολὴ which give the Latin stola). So at first glance, we should rather correct the first list for the compounds of strategia, sphragis.

For more safety and to be complete, I will review all the words starting with apo, epi and pseudo. If you have other words of Greek origin to submit, please add them.

[wehro]

If I understand it correctly, the etymology shall be respected if the second element of the compound is in use in Latin. So sy-no-dus and sy-na-go-ge, but arch-an-ge-lus?

[fradec]

Yes, I think it could be summed up like that, but I don't know if it can have a systematic value. It is necessary to check if this can apply everywhere (!) before adding the precision in the doc. I see that archangelus would be corrected in this case, now it gives ar-chan-ge-lus.

For words beginning with apo-, epi- and pseud-, I found, according to this rule, 6 errors to correct:

• a-pos-phra-gis-ma should be a-po-sphra-gis-ma
• e-pis-tra-te-gi-a should be e-pi-stra-te-gi-a
• e-pis-tra-te-gus should be e-pi-stra-te-gus
• e-pis-ty-li-um should be e-pi-sty-li-um
• Pseu-do-sto-mon should be Pseu-dos-to-mon
• pseu-do-z-ma-rag-dus should be pseu-do-zma-rag-dus (bug)

[fradec]

At the moment, 9 patterns are added to solve these problems (including archangelus), but I did not commit anything for the moment, I await your opinion and any other corrections you can suggest.

[wehro]

I agree that it is not always possible to follow a strict rule.

Your corrections look good. In the case of epistylium, I think one could also justify e-pis-ty-li-um.

A comprehensive solution for the problem of Greek compound is not easy as there are lots of such words in the dictionaries (even if the most of them seem to be very rare). I found some problems with words beginning with dia- like diapsalma, diaschisma, diasmyrnes and with parhelion.
Furthermore, I am not sure how words ending in -archus should be treated (comarchus, demarchus, exarchus, pentacontarchus etc.)

[fradec]

I agree that it is not always possible to follow a strict rule.

Perhaps we will have to say what are the choices that have been made, and under what principles, while indicating that this can not be systematic.

Your corrections look good. In the case of epistylium, I think one could also justify e-pis-ty-li-um.

Yes, I agree. I hesitated, because even if στῦλος mostly passed into Latin through the compounds (I found 18 items: amphiprostylos, aræostylos, decastylos, diastylos, duodecastylus, epistylium, eustylos, hecatonstylos, hexastylos, octastylos, peristylium, peristylum, prostylos, pycnostylos, stylobata, systylos, tetrastylum, tetrastylus), there is no unanimity for the link with the Latin stilus (Gaffiot vs Goelzer for example). So there is a choice to make here, I think, for my part, to consider that all have the same origin with a pattern that keeps the group st indivisible.

A comprehensive solution for the problem of Greek compound is not easy as there are lots of such words in the dictionaries (even if the most of them seem to be very rare). I found some problems with words beginning with dia- like diapsalma, diaschisma, diasmyrnes and with parhelion.

I found also diapsoricum, diapsychon, diascorodon, diaspermaton, diasteaton, diastema, diastematicus, diastole, diastoleus, diastylos, parhedrus, parhippus, parhomœologia, parhomœon, parhypate …

Furthermore, I am not sure how words ending in -archus should be treated (comarchus, demarchus, exarchus, pentacontarchus etc.)

11 items, apart from proper nouns, this may be related to the question of stilus / epistylium. There is the Latin word archon, archontis, transliteration of the Greek ἄρχων, which could possibly justify a break before ar. But it requires more thought.

[fradec]

Furthermore, I am not sure how words ending in -archus should be treated (comarchus, demarchus, exarchus, pentacontarchus etc.)

11 items, apart from proper nouns, this may be related to the question of stilus / epistylium. There is the Latin word archon, archontis, transliteration of the Greek ἄρχων, which could possibly justify a break before ar. But it requires more thought.

If my count is good, there is almost 30 words from the same Greek root (notion of authority, leader), all do not present a difficulty, of course:
agonistarcha, alytarcha, alytarchia, arabarchia, biarchia, biarchus, chiliarchus, cimeliarcha, comarchus, demarchia, demarchus, diætarcha, exarchus, gymnasiarchus, hæresiarcha, irenarcha, limenarcha, monarchia, nauarchia, navarchus, patriarcha, pentacontarchus, phylarchus, sitarchia, tetrarchia, tœcharchus, toparcha, toparchia, tricliniarcha, trierarcha, trierarchus, xystarcha

A priori, personally however, I'm not inclined to put the hyphen before ar-. It sounds odd to me, but maybe it's because it's never been seen before, simply.

[wehro]

There are even more words from this root, ending in -arches: Boeotarches, Cypriarches, Magnetarches, …
In German, the division before arch is quite common, e.g. in »Mon-ar-chie«, even if the syllabic hyphenation »Mo-nar-chie« is allowed as an alternative since the German spelling reform of 1996.
The etymologic hyphenation makes it easier to understand the structure of a word, given, that the reader has some knowledge of Greek.
On the other hand, the syllabic hyphenation is more useful for chant.

So you are right, there is a decision to be made.

[fradec]

There are even more words from this root, ending in -arches: Boeotarches, Cypriarches, Magnetarches, …

In general, the proper nouns are treated separately because they do not always follow the same rule, that's why I had discarded them.
We prefer to apply to them the basic rules, here for example Bo-e-o-tar-ches

The etymologic hyphenation makes it easier to understand the structure of a word, given, that the reader has some knowledge of Greek.

The question here would be: what would the Latins have done in their day?!

On the other hand, the syllabic hyphenation is more useful for chant.

I think this is not a problem, as long as there is the right syllable count.
We have already quon-i-am…

So you are right, there is a decision to be made.

If I summarize for the record, there are basically two main cases.

The first is that of the Greek words that are passed in Latin with compounds, like strategia. The compounds therefore claim an hyphenation that apparently respects the Greek root since we can reasonably assume that the root evokes something to the homo latinus. I say apparently, because in fact it is not so much because of the Greek root as because the word exists in Latin, the Greek root becoming in a way a Latin root. (I hope what I say is pretty much understandable!)

The second case is that of compound words whose Greek root is not passed in Latin, as apostolus. In these cases, the normal Latin hyphenation is used without taking into account the Greek etymology: a-pos-to-lus.

So in the case of arch* compounds (but perhaps also other families of words), the question is whether archon can take the place of a Greek root passed in Latin sufficiently clear so that it can evoke something to the homo latinus? It is taken as such in Latin only in proarchon, whose hyphenation does not pose any difficulty. For the other words, there is the same Greek root, but not the same Latin "root" (so to speak, it's not a root obviously). That's why I prefer not to put the hyphen before the ar-.

[fradec]

I fixed the forms enunciated above, according to the principles stated. Of course it will be possible to change, if necessary.

[wehro]

For pseudisodomos, I prefer pseud-i-so-do-mos to pseu-di-so-do-mos, because even isodomos appears in the dictionaries.

[wehro]

There is a couple of compound words beginning with tetra. The interesting cases so far not covered by the word lists are tetragnathius, tetraptotos, tetrastichos, and tetrastylos.

[wehro]

Difficult cases beginning with the Greek prefix peri are peripsema, peripteros, periscelis, peristasis, peristroma, peristrophe, peristylium, and peristylum.

[wehro]

I would prefer ther-mo-spo-di-on to ther-mos-po-di-on as there is a Latin word spodium.

[wehro]

perispomenon should be hyphenated pe-ris-po-me-non (or, etymologically, pe-ri-spo-me-non), but not per-is-po-me-non.

[wehro]

melaspermon means “black semen”. The hyphenation should be me-la-sper-mon.

[wehro]

The same holds for lithospermon: li-tho-sper-mon.

[wehro]

The hyphenations of the following words beginning with anti should be checked carefully: antisagoge, antispasticus, antispastus, antispodos, antistichon, antistoechon.

[wehro]

Difficult word beginning with penta:

• pentaspaston
• pentasphærum
• pentastichos
• pentathlum